Pokerstars

If they set up hands it would be something do inside the software. That is a really big secret to keep quiet. The hardest thing about keeping a secret quiet is the number of people involved. To alter software and keep it hidden requires that only certain people be allowed to check the code. Someone would of let it slip by now. Look at how fast the AP cheating story made the rounds in the poker world. If a site was setting up hands, you would of heard about it by now and the site would end up with no players and $0 in income. I don't see risking the amount of money they make to attempt to gain a few bucks extra. All sites cap their rake at somewhere around $4 max, no matter the size of the pot. When you get to the 2/4 NL or 3/6 Limit level you see the rake capped every hand.

good points, but how many people still play at the sites where cheating was discovered? The same amount, less, or more? I think they would make as much money as they do now even if something like this came out. The PR would just spin it

I checked back in on AP not to long ago, quite some time after the cheating incident. The site isn't "dead," but it isn't near as busy as it used to be. No site will completely dissolve after a cheating incident, but they will see way reduced traffic and a way reduced rake from hands. Why risk losing money on a low return venture? That, if I know anything about business, doesn't sound like a good venture.

Ok. Thanks for the input. IS this why AP and UB merged?

I don't know the timeline on the AP and UB merger vs the timeline on the cheating incident. I do know that the cheater was either an employee or former employee that told them their software was susceptible to hacking. The incident in a nut shell was this: He hacked the software and was able to see everyone's hole cards during the game. He ended up winning around $200,000 in a tournament with this hack. Someone asked for the hand histories to see what happened and AP screwed up. They sent histories with EVERY hole card of everyone. Through basic deduction people figured out something was up and approached AP with the information. They issued multiple apologies and attempted to make the situation right, which I don't know what they did.

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Originally Posted by ScareCrowAKA

So you dont think they set up the hands -to get as much people into the pot as possible... inorder to get more from the rake?

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ABSOLUTELY NOT! Also, there is a cap on the rake at each limit.

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Originally Posted by ffcowboy76

I don't know the timeline on the AP and UB merger vs the timeline on the cheating incident. I do know that the cheater was either an employee or former employee that told them their software was susceptible to hacking. The incident in a nut shell was this: He hacked the software and was able to see everyone's hole cards during the game. He ended up winning around $200,000 in a tournament with this hack. Someone asked for the hand histories to see what happened and AP screwed up. They sent histories with EVERY hole card of everyone. Through basic deduction people figured out something was up and approached AP with the information. They issued multiple apologies and attempted to make the situation right, which I don't know what they did.

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The person that was playing didn't see everyone's whole cards, there was another person who saw everyone's cards, who then told his buddy at the table.

That is incorrect. All of the reports stated that the person that won had access to everyone's hole cards.

Here is a link to the many reports
http://www.natarem.com/2007/10/17/ab...ating-scandal/

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Originally Posted by ffcowboy76

That is incorrect. All of the reports stated that the person that won had access to everyone's hole cards.

Here is a link to the many reports
http://www.natarem.com/2007/10/17/ab...ating-scandal/

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I got my information from an AP employee.

I was right. ah ha ha. Conspiracy!.. lol actually I was pissed after losing 3 times in a row after the the board came out. KQQKK, JAKJJ, AK2KA. However, this type of stuff still does not ease my suspicions.

http://www.pokerrng.com/poker-room-robots.asp

When i used to have money online, i felt that some HU players in ring games played basically the same. I believe that there are bots on stars, but not necessarily run by stars.

Unfortunately it is very hard for sites to catch/prove that bots are in the game or exist. An amusing story came about a while ago about Hevad "Rainman" Khan. His account on Pokerstars was banned because of supposed use of a "bot". Hevad was playing over 40 sng's at a single time. He sent a screen shot of his computer screen playing in this sng's. His account was reinstated and Pokerstars apologized. Several accusations have been made on various sites, but administrators are hesitant to act because of their looking foolish if they are wrong. An interesting topic because of the many people that regard the use of a bot as cheating yet there have been very few attempts in trying to regulate or control the use in the sites. On pdcpoker there is a player that many believe to be a bot, some of you may have seen "his" name nolimit6. If you ask around it is a pretty unanimous group (those who have been around for >1 year) that have played against "him" and believe "he" is a bot. They have reported and nothing has been done by pdcpoker.